Discussion Forum Leica S System S2 S2 endangering other cameras you own?
  • #1273
    fotografz

    I know some folks had to off other gear to get their S2, Fortunately, I didn't … BUT …

    I'm finding the camera so versatile that as I use it more and more, the other stuff is just taking a snooze in my gear vault.

    While I can't be without a higher speed camera like my Sony A900 that focuses better in lower light … even those circumstances of use are hard to justify having a full blown Sony system anymore.

    The real kick in the pants is my H4D/60 and zillion HC lenses and accessories … which has recently been superseded in so many occasions by the S2 that it's actually a little depressing.

    I guess the world changes for each of us, and we come to the realization of what we need and how in my case I need no more than a camera like the S2 delivers.

    Maybe it's time to off a bunch of stuff … which is a bit ironic since I'll end up in the same place as those who had to do it to get their S2. Having some cash for upcoming S lenses probably isn't a bad idea anyway.

    Your thoughts?

    -Marc

  • #1274
    arminw

    I use the S2 and my H4d50 … both are used regularly … I shoot a lot tethered so the Hassi is the one I use most and for more freehand stuff I take the S2 for a spin …

  • #1275
    David K

    I was fortunate not to have had to sell either my Nikon D3S or M9 systems to acquire the S2 kit although I did have to part with my earlier MF kit and a LOT more lenses to afford it.

    As my results improve with the S2 I have given serious thought to whether the Nikon D3S system is something I should consider selling. The main advantages for me with the Nikon kit are it's low light capabilities, longer reach, much faster capture rate (for sports) and it's near foolproof AF system…the most important of which (to me) has been AF. I'm not sure whether Leica has improved the AF on the S2 or if I've improved but the gap between these two systems has narrowed dramatically. I am nailing a much higher percentage of shots with the Leica now than I did in the early days. And while the images with the Nikon are very good…they don't WOW me the way the Leica shots do.

    My M9 kit is sacrosanct…at least for as long as I am able to afford to keep it. For me it's just in a completely different category than the S2. I use it less than I should but that's mostly because I enjoy shooting with the S2 so much that I select that system even when the M would be the more intelligent choice.

    I am not surprised to hear that the S2 is encroaching on your use of the H4D/60 kit. To my mind the S2 can do most things the Hassy or Phase systems can do in a much more convenient and flexible package. I find myself shooting my S2 in many more situations than I did with my earlier MF kit…sounds like you are too.

  • #1276
    David Farkas

    I've made no secret that I use the S2 for almost all of my shooting these days. I actually feel guilty for not using my M gear as much as I used to. I've been an avid M shooter for years, but always had an affinity for SLR shooting as well. The R9/DMR was great and I was a huge advocate and enthusiastic user of the system. But, at the time, I used the DMR and the M8 pretty much 50/50. Now, with the S2, I might only use the M 10% of the time.

    I speak to a lot of S2 owners that feel exactly the same way. The S2 is just a pleasure to use and produces extraordinary results. It's hard to top that.

  • #1277
    Arif

    I was very happy with the S2 in my trip to Burma and Indonesia that I now use it almost all the time which has been a very pleasant plus. I was quite depressed in the fact that I had to send it off to Solms for replacing the top LED and now that it is back, I don't use my M9 and recently sold the D3S. Nostalgia stops me from selling the M9 but I may end up selling it and just keep my MP and my 35 Aspherical for the days when I feel like shooting film.

  • #1278
    Arif

    David Farkas;1065 wrote: I've made no secret that I use the S2 for almost all of my shooting these days. I actually feel guilty for not using my M gear as much as I used to. I've been an avid M shooter for years, but always had an affinity for SLR shooting as well. The R9/DMR was great and I was a huge advocate and enthusiastic user of the system. But, at the time, I used the DMR and the M8 pretty much 50/50. Now, with the S2, I might only use the M 10% of the time.

    I speak to a lot of S2 owners that feel exactly the same way. The S2 is just a pleasure to use and produces extraordinary results. It's hard to top that.

    David, let me know if you ever want to sell your 35 anthracite 😉 I have just the camera to match it.

  • #1279
    David Farkas

    Arif;1067 wrote: David, let me know if you ever want to sell your 35 anthracite 😉 I have just the camera to match it.

    How did you know about my 35 cron ASPH Anthracite? I don't remember posting that info online…. :confused:

    I think I'll hold onto it…along with my silver 90 Elmarit. Some vices are hard to give up (lenses too). 😀

  • #1280
    Cam Garner

    No question I'm using the S2 more and more. On my recent trip to Hawaii, I only took the S2. I was sorry I left the 5D II at home as I missed out on some night photography. The S2 would not work for me as the only camera when doing extensive travel photography. On my trip to Burma, 90% of my shooting was handheld and probably 50% of the images were shot at 800+ ISO. As the S2 continues to evolve with better high ISO performance and with a zoom lens I will use it more often. I have to admit it's always the S2 I want to take because I love shooting with it and the image quality is vastly superior to my DSLR. Besides why simplify life with only one camera system:D

  • #1284
    Kurt Kamka

    I posted this on another thread as follow-up but don't know if you saw it. Has there been any more discussion from Leica on what you mentioned earlier? As S2 users continue to increase the range of applications in which they engage the S2, I'm willing to go out on a limb and say that adding the extra stop or two would be incredibly useful for those S2 users.

    Originally Posted by David Farkas
    Okay, here is a big one I left off that I've written about before…

    Dr. Zimmer, head of digital R&D, explained that noise could be reduced by either dropping the sensor readout from 24Mhz to 12Mhz or by using a dual readout vs. a quad readout from the sensor. Either of these options would cut the continous frame rate in half and double the time from capture to review, but also would deliver a one stop improvement in noise performance. He indicated that it should be possible to make these changes on the fly in firmware. So, here's my suggestion:

    Allow the user three modes to choose from:
    Regular
    Reduced noise
    Lowest noise

    The regular mode would operate like it is now.

    The reduced noise mode would cut the readout rate. ISO 1250 would look as good as 640, 320 would look like 160 and base ISO 160 might been look a little better, too. The trade-off is that the continuous shooting rate would drop to 0.75 fps.

    Lowest noise mode would cut the readout rate AND switch the sensor to dual output. The effect should a be 2-stop improvement in noise performance. An extended ISO of 2500 or even 5000 could be offered. ISO 2500 would look as good 640. The drawback to this setting would be a reduction in frame rate to 0.375 fps and probably a good half second to display on the LCD. Pretty slow, but could mean the difference between actually getting a shot and getting nothing.

    Compared to pixel binning options like Phase's Sensor+, this solution would offer full resolution not 1/4 res.

  • #1285
    iainmurray

    Since I've had the S2 I've enjoyed using it so much, and been so delighted with the results, that my previously treasured M9 hasn't been touched. I am now enduring agonies of indecision. Should I sell the M9, my three Lux lenses, my Tele-Elmar 135 and my Summicron 90? The proceeds would go a long way towards covering the cost of the S2, the 70mm Summarit and the two Hasselblad/Zeiss lenses I've acquired. I think I'll hang on a little longer. Then again…

  • #1286
    David Farkas

    Kurt Kamka;1073 wrote: I posted this on another thread as follow-up but don't know if you saw it. Has there been any more discussion from Leica on what you mentioned earlier? As S2 users continue to increase the range of applications in which they engage the S2, I'm willing to go out on a limb and say that adding the extra stop or two would be incredibly useful for those S2 users.

    Kurt,

    I did see it. Josh and I are meeting with S2 product managers Stephan Shulz and Toni Felsner this afternoon. We have plenty to discuss, and I'm hoping, lots to share after our meeting.

  • #1288
    Kurt Kamka

    If they need any beta testers, just let me know … I'd volunteer in a heartbeat. 😉 If they are/were able to introduce this as a firmware update, it'd be a great additional selling point.

    Kurt

  • #1289
    David K

    David Farkas;1075 wrote: Kurt,

    I did see it. Josh and I are meeting with S2 product managers Stephan Shulz and Toni Felsner this afternoon. We have plenty to discuss, and I'm hoping, lots to share after our meeting.

    Don't bother coming back to Florida without micro prism screens 🙂

  • #1292
    fotografz

    Well, I guess I'm not alone in all this.

    David, when you do your sit down, please convey what a bang-up job they have done with the S2 for me/us.

    Frankly, the more they improve the current S2 with firmware (and that includes more in-between ISO choices if possible), the more desirable and usable the camera becomes to more people. I really don't see a need for more megs, just keep improving this one!

    it may be a sore point but my S2 has a CS indicator on the switch, would love to use it : -)

    -Marc

  • #1311
    Doug

    Marc, I have similar thoughts. The world changes. Shortly after I got an M8, my local pro film lab closed its doors. Just like that, my world went digital, and I have rarely used any of my many film cameras since. Most should go to someone who will use them. Getting the S2, I sold nothing. I never used my Pentax dSLRs much, but now with the S2 they're really getting lonely too.

  • #1318
    rgk

    My S2 hasn't endangered my other cameras at all. In fact, they are much safer now that they never leave the house.

  • #1346
    David Duffin

    My first post here.

    I'm a retired engineer — an extremely fortunate one, as I have an M9 with several lenses, an S2 with all four lenses plus a 30mm on order, and an Alpa SWA with IQ180 and Schneider and Rodenstock optics. In all, the S2 gets used for about 80% of my images! The other two rigs now each get used maybe 10%.

    But I can't see myself giving up any of the three. The speed of the 24/1.4, the 35/1.4, and the speed and rendering of the 50/0.95 make the M-series irreplaceable for low-light shots. The rise capability of the Alpa and the superb resolution of the IQ180 can't be beaten for landscape shots when time and light conditions permit.

    The S2 gets by far the most use in normal light because the sensor resolution is all that's usually needed, the battery life is great, it's weather-sealed, rugged, easy to focus, and the lenses are incomparable. As near-perfect a camera system as I've found. The only minor annoyances occur during my frequent lens changes when having to dismount and remount the bulky lens shades instead of retracting them and the seemingly constant difficulty getting the front lens caps properly seated without close inspection. Simple slide-on aluminum lens caps would be better.

    Don't get me wrong, the S2 system is superb as-is, but nevertheless I do have a wants list:

    1. A Leica-quality 70-200mm equivalent zoom
    2. Delivery of long-awaited microprism focusing screen
    3. Brighter indications of aperture, ISO, and EV settings in viewfinder
    4. Improved response when tethered
    5. Elimination of “beyond-infinity” manual focus travel on the lenses
    6. Improved and extended high-ISO performance

  • #1406
    constable

    Not endangering other camera … they don't get taken out to play in the nasty wet wild world so often, but rather get to stay at home in their nice warm cupboard.

    Endangering the pocket though. I am using the S2 so much in the wild that I have just decided to upgrade to the S2-P for maximum protection in the field. I am collecting it later this morning.

    I still need the D3X/S for distance work with long lenses though. The D7000/S2 is an interesting travel combination (and the D400/S2 will be even better I guess).

    Ed

  • #1511
    Paratom

    I just found that thread.
    I kept my Nikon D700 and M9 when I got the S2. The D700 for fast AF and tele. However I really have used the D700 nearly zero for the last months.
    The M9 I have usd occasionally (for example on vacation when I didnt want to carry the S2).
    And then I use a smaller camera for bycicle tours, or for evenings/ parties etc. (m4/3, x1 or now Nex).
    So yes I also thought to sell the Nikon. Bt selling and rebuying is so expensive that I rather wait a little longer to be 100% sure.
    The M9 I want to keep – the M is the only system I have constantly used for over 20 years now.

    Overall I am really happy that the S2, for which I spent soo much money does work so good for me.
    Sometimes I think I am crazy to carry such big camera around for casual shooting.
    I am planning to use the M9 a little more again as well.

    The great thing (besides others) for me is that the files out of the S2 and M9 are just so good without any or maybe slight post processing. I am also very uch surprized how precise the S2 AF works. I barely have any OOF images (as long as subject isnt too fast moving)
    Regards,Tom

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